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Andy Garton
17-11-2011, 17:33
I'll try to be concise:

For the next few weeks up until Christmas we will continue the design input phase as well as working on core essential tech. The game design document will then be updated and agreed by everyone, followed by a detailed schedule. By mid-February or so we should be fully started on the main implementation phase which will follow the design document and schedule closely.

Up until that time our core tech and art focus will be on the following, to give you an idea of what to expect from upcoming builds:

1. Continued work on physics and handling.
2. New input system to eliminate lag.
3. Dynamic environment system (time of day and weather).
4. Comprehensive leaderboard system.
5. New cars and tracks.
6. Continued work on making the GUI more usable.
7. Minor features/options suggested by members which have a low cost.
8. Ongoing bug fixing (focused on major issues only).

oldschool
17-11-2011, 18:07
7. Minor features/options suggested by members which have a low cost.

Could this possibly include TrackIR support?

tjc
18-11-2011, 11:05
All sounds good to me... :)

Goran Johansson
18-11-2011, 11:37
So online playing is longer away or have I misunderstood. That's the thing I most look forward to. Some of the cars are good enough already that you would like to run some races against each other.

flymar
18-11-2011, 17:01
I hope the point 3 will be implemented minding the voices from "lighting" thread.

WallyM
19-11-2011, 03:22
I would like to hear from SMS what kind of input from us team members they value or need the most, given this plan.

(and I am really looking forward to #3).

Micas
19-11-2011, 06:23
Wouldn't AI be considered "core tech", or is it implicit in one of the other categories Andy listed?

Andy Garton
19-11-2011, 08:55
Wouldn't AI be considered "core tech", or is it implicit in one of the other categories Andy listed?
It's certainly core tech but is much more progressed already than dynamic time and weather for example. The AI improvements we know we need to make will come in the full schedule during the main implementation phase. We are though planning to expose some more detailed AI parameters in the UI soon (within weeks) so that the team can experiment more and find what works best.

Christian Schegtel
19-11-2011, 21:26
Nothing on multiplayer yet? Sort of a big deal for pretty much everyone...

Andy Garton
19-11-2011, 21:47
Nothing on multiplayer yet? Sort of a big deal for pretty much everyone...
Good point, MP is being worked on currently and will continue to be. It's highly unlikely to reach builds in any form before Christmas, but you never know. Certainly the full dedicated server best-racing-online ever system will take much longer than that though.

wip3
19-11-2011, 21:54
I don't think that multiplayer is that important at this state. Creating the multiplayer and getting it to work the way it should is going to be a huge job. I just think it isn't necessary yet and there are more important aspects at the moment.

Graine de Pilote
21-11-2011, 09:40
And since the timing table is implemented, there is already a new addictive side for pCARS. You can see the World Record and the time of the others team member and it's altready a very interesting feature to have.
I'm far from the records but it's good to have a time reference for each car/track combination!

Simon Kaminski
21-11-2011, 11:38
Same here I am slow like driving with 100 PS less D:

phl90
22-11-2011, 13:10
Just a comment regarding your planning regarding the size of the build you plan to have.

Build 71 = 801Mb
Build 96=1.28Gb
Build 130 > 2 Gb ??
Build GA = 6Gb ?? :o

Do you think that it would better to have an incremental package in a couple of weeks / months ? Does anybody work on this topic ?

Big Ron
22-11-2011, 13:12
Just a comment regarding your planning regarding the size of the build you plan to have.

Build 71 = 801Mb
Build 96=1.28Gb
Build 130 > 2 Gb ??
Build GA = 6Gb ?? :o

Do you think that it would better to have an incremental package in a couple of weeks / months ? Does anybody work on this topic ?

I think, at a certain level they will release a build and going to continue with patches instead of full versions. They are already thinking about this.

Viktor Kolomiets
22-11-2011, 13:39
I suspect that once we are over 2.5gb size we will have to apply patch logic, but at this time it's anything but straightforward. As I have explained a number of times in a couple of threads in Builds subforum, it isn't as straightforward or yielding good results (some patches will be massive at this point, because certain changes to data and/or tools pipelines will result in 90+% of normal build size patch sizes, not any one of us likes but it happens, often enough to make patches sort of useless. I still need a few more decisions to be made in regards to it (methods/software), will prompt my bosses for a response again

Big Ron
22-11-2011, 13:43
That is a very understandable reason. It maybe takes more time to set correct patches for every file as just send the whole build at once. But at any point some users will get problems. I canīt download 3 to 5 GB every week as it would take half day and my connection could be lost at some points.

Another idea would be to create a little downloader for your builds (maybe with peer to peer) with a feature, that reconnects lost connections automatically and so saving user from restarting the download. Then we can run the download without fears over the day till its finished.

EDITH: when I am right, you are offeren torrent files, which can downloaded via download managers offering this features.

Priit Vork
22-11-2011, 13:46
Actually the build size hasn't increased that much over time so far.
http://puu.sh/97Ew

Viktor Kolomiets
22-11-2011, 13:52
Actually the build size hasn't increased that much over time so far.
http://puu.sh/97Ew

Yeah, my favourite period of development, hehe. But trust me, they start to grow at fast rate at some points, mainly when new content (tracks/cars) are added. We managed to half that rate by using some clever shared assets combining features, but there are no more savings to be had at any point any more using that method, once new content gets added

Jaja
23-11-2011, 15:35
Happy to see that physics is the top priority for now. Developping intensely AI when the thing it has to drive is not finished seem to be wasted effort.

Matthew Hardwick
24-11-2011, 06:38
Perhaps when it gets bigger it can be split up into content packs that are updated separately.
There can be the core files which includes the executable with 1 car and test track, and then packs which each include certain cars and tracks.

lava
24-11-2011, 08:42
@SMS: When builds get really large in the future, have you thought about instead of offering an installer, going through a versioning system for distribution e.g. Git (I know it's more for sources than binary distribution, but maybe it could be used in that way too)? Ie. there would be an online Git repository everyone pulls the individual files from. There is TortoiseGit which integrates itself into Windows Explorer, so Users wouldn't have to use commandline tools. Or you could have a minimal "installer" which contains a customized Git client for this purpose that atomatically pulls files?

Captain Crunch
26-11-2011, 05:13
I think some people are forgetting that many games and sims alike fail when it comes to MP features. If MP isn't given enough consideration at the early stages, the MP features always feel like a second thought rather than an important feature. If others here have ever played GRID from Codemasters you know what I'm talking about. GRID Was A pretty good game but the MP was total trash. Even though recent Codemasters game have gotten better they still do not have a robust netcode or feature set. I just hope that the WMD/CARS team decides to put the assets to work to prove they are honestly making a player driven community and sim, because without high quality MP wheres the community?

Rodrigo Borba
27-11-2011, 13:10
Frankly I would not trade for 5 multiplayer modes and a 1 decent physical well resolved.
We can have both? of course yes, but I want quality at the moment.

Big Ron
27-11-2011, 13:15
Frankly I would not trade for 5 multiplayer modes and a 1 decent physical well resolved.
We can have both? of course yes, but I want quality at the moment.

What has a multiplayer-mode to do with physics?

Rodrigo Borba
29-11-2011, 02:03
What has a multiplayer-mode to do with physics?

I think you do not understand that it is only a comparative, it was not literal.
Cheers !

BloodyJesus
29-11-2011, 18:34
Sounds really good. Can't wait for the next build on friday :)

Andy Garton
12-01-2012, 10:42
A brief update - we're still not quite ready to enter full design, planning and production but we have come up with a short term priority list based on member feedback and available team resources. In very rough priority order (but all will be started soon if they haven't been already) this is:

Input lag (new threading system)
New FFB system
Car specific steering lock support
Fix low speed grip issue
Trees improved
Improved car reflections
Car and track updates as usual
Tire deformation
Open face driver added for 67 car
AI parameters exposed in UI
Night lighting
"High detail player car" option added to UI
Vehicle livery selection in UI
1st person driver animations
GUI usability improvements (including track select menu)
Kart physics fixes (low speed grip fix will help a lot)
Leaderboards (specifically client-server instant updates, ghost support)
Multiplayer
Pit-to-car radio
Damage fixes/improvements, including wheel to wheel contacts
Dynamic time/weather system
Driving school
Slow motion replays
Camera tool for use by team members
Web leaderboards
Helmet cam with reflections

Remco Van Dijk
12-01-2012, 10:54
"High detail player car" option added to UI
Isn't this one already available? At least I was able to select Ultra in the latest build.

Andy Garton
12-01-2012, 11:00
Isn't this one already available? At least I was able to select Ultra in the latest build.
Nearly, it needs car updates as well though - should be done for today's build hopefully.

FLX81
12-01-2012, 11:25
I love this list! When thats all set and will come out as good as the rest already is, we will have one hell of a game for real... :D

Is it too much to ask for a rough estimate on when the individual improments will make it into the game, circa?

Big Ron
12-01-2012, 11:57
Impressive and promising list. Hope, you guys will make all that happen and donīt get into trouble firmly attached to something for too long, bringing your term plan outta control.

Rob Prange
12-01-2012, 12:37
Just to add that before the question arises, work on the content items (cars & tracks) continues as well of course :)

Andy Garton
12-01-2012, 12:41
Just to add that before the question arises, work on the content items (cars & tracks) continues as well of course :)
... and it's in the list anyway :)

Rob Prange
12-01-2012, 12:43
Eh, should have put on my glasses right then, sorry :)

Micas
12-01-2012, 13:15
Awesome list of priority items. I'd imagine it's not really appropriate to ask to tag on some additional items to the list, but I'm going to do it anyway.. :)

In terms of the AI modification, is there any chance to add some basic improvements? For example, the AI always drastically slows down on the first turn at Connecticut and piles up. I've also seen the AI get stuck on the track walls, and sometime go in reverse on the track. It would be nice to have a finer control on the AI's lap times instead of being limited to choosing medium or hard. If I could set it so the fastest AI car is lapping slightly faster than my PB, it would be really fun. Fixing that would allow turning laps to be less mundane at an earlier stage of development, so I'd be more inclined to play/test more often.

Andy Garton
12-01-2012, 13:18
Awesome list of priority items. I'd imagine it's not really appropriate to ask to tag on some additional items to the list, but I'm going to do it anyway.. :)

In terms of the AI modification, is there any chance to add some basic improvements? For example, the AI always drastically slows down on the first turn at Connecticut and piles up. I've also seen the AI get stuck on the track walls, and sometime go in reverse on the track. It would be nice to have a finer control on the AI's lap times instead of being limited to choosing medium or hard. If I could set it so the fastest AI car is lapping slightly faster than my PB, it would be really fun. Fixing that would allow turning laps to be less mundane at an earlier stage of development, so I'd be more inclined to play/test more often.
The AI item listed will give you that fine control (of AI strength, aggression, defensive ability, start ability, overtaking ability and several more).

Small track specific fixes like the CH first corner are quick and easy also, for Doug to do, so should ideally be reported in the physics and AI forum.

DahakacL
12-01-2012, 13:29
"short term" what it means to you guys?, 1 month?, 3 months?...

I ask because the list is amazing and i want to play it ASAP xD.

Andy Garton
12-01-2012, 13:33
"short term" what it means to you guys?, 1 month?, 3 months?...

I ask because the list is amazing and i want to play it ASAP xD.
It was a plan for Jan/Feb/Mar initially, but a couple of larger effort items (e.g. dynamic time/weather) have been moved on to the list which will likely take longer (we'll see at least some progress on it soon though).

Jaja
12-01-2012, 14:15
Bringing to all cars and fine tuning the last improvement in physics (even grip coeff on 4 wheel/bias in load sensitivity/tuning load sensitivity for each car) has to be very near to the top IMHO because we'll finally start on good foundations for developping physics (with low speed grip issue fix).

Reaper 392
12-01-2012, 15:24
Awesome list of priority items. I'd imagine it's not really appropriate to ask to tag on some additional items to the list, but I'm going to do it anyway.. :)

In terms of the AI modification, is there any chance to add some basic improvements? For example, the AI always drastically slows down on the first turn at Connecticut and piles up. I've also seen the AI get stuck on the track walls, and sometime go in reverse on the track. It would be nice to have a finer control on the AI's lap times instead of being limited to choosing medium or hard. If I could set it so the fastest AI car is lapping slightly faster than my PB, it would be really fun. Fixing that would allow turning laps to be less mundane at an earlier stage of development, so I'd be more inclined to play/test more often.

i dont know if its my driving style, or just how the AI are working, but its feels to me like the AI are using a very old tyre model or something. they are braking stupidly early (in some cases up to 100m before my normal braking point) and not very hard for corners. they are going round some corners a hell of alot faster than i can if i take the same line and they are having difficulty accelerating out of corners, especially the first one on CH

Evgeniy Neytman
12-01-2012, 17:11
Looks good, keep going, ur able to catch ISI:)

DahakacL
12-01-2012, 17:18
It was a plan for Jan/Feb/Mar initially, but a couple of larger effort items (e.g. dynamic time/weather) have been moved on to the list which will likely take longer (we'll see at least some progress on it soon though).

So, the list will be completed (the points that was announced today) on Abril or May right?

GMSimRacer
12-01-2012, 17:21
That sounds good - got me thinking I have never seen a " replay highlights" feature. It would work using a pre-defined computer algorithm to generate and interesting auto replay of the race - what do you think? So it could include race start, incidents and finish etc...

Dominic Schoenberner
12-01-2012, 18:34
Oh man.... That would be an AMAZING game!!! ;)

Andy Jackson
15-01-2012, 17:08
That sounds good - got me thinking I have never seen a " replay highlights" feature. It would work using a pre-defined computer algorithm to generate and interesting auto replay of the race - what do you think? So it could include race start, incidents and finish etc...

I would love that. GP4 had directors mode, but this could be so much better with a directors mode highlights system.

Jose Luis Ametller
15-01-2012, 19:52
This list is far better than I expected! I didn't notice anthing regarding pitstops. They will be worked later this year I assume...

ermo
16-01-2012, 00:59
Andy & Co.

May I humbly suggest adding an arrow ( <- **milestone or somesuch ) to the list to signify when you guys will cut the next promotional release? Perhaps something like:


A brief update - we're still not quite ready to enter full design, planning and production but we have come up with a short term priority list based on member feedback and available team resources. In very rough priority order (but all will be started soon if they haven't been already) this is:

Input lag (new threading system)
New FFB system
Car specific steering lock support
Fix low speed grip issue <- **milestone release when the first 4 action items are sorted and verified
Trees improved
Improved car reflections
Car and track updates as usual
Tire deformation
Open face driver added for 67 car
AI parameters exposed in UI
Night lighting
"High detail player car" option added to UI
Vehicle livery selection in UI
1st person driver animations
GUI usability improvements (including track select menu)
Kart physics fixes (low speed grip fix will help a lot)
Leaderboards (specifically client-server instant updates, ghost support)
Multiplayer
Pit-to-car radio
Damage fixes/improvements, including wheel to wheel contacts
Dynamic time/weather system
Driving school
Slow motion replays
Camera tool for use by team members
Web leaderboards
Helmet cam with reflections

Presumably, the artwork guys and the physics guys will carry on their work in parallel to the core engine tech and server side work, so by the time e.g. the core threading work lands and has been subjected to testing by the wider community a few weeks from now, you might as well use the opportunity to release a Junior+ build to generate interest (and possibly convert this interest to new paying members) by announcing a few milestone bullet points as valar suggested elsewhere on the forum (http://forum.wmdportal.com/showthread.php?2310-Is-the-project-semi-cancelled-%28NO!%29/page7&p=46544#post46544)?

terrian
16-01-2012, 10:08
Input lag (new threading system)
New FFB system
Car specific steering lock support
Fix low speed grip issue

Well, I'm glad the biggest problems (if pCARS is meant to be a competitive sim) have the highest priorities.
To be honest, a demo without these improvements would probably do more harm than good... In an ideal world, I wouldn't release a racing sim demo before the physics & input were at least in the beta phase.

Ismatuner
16-01-2012, 20:53
I think there s a lot of cars very detailed, but the game menus can be better, they aren t very intuitive

Pugamall
18-01-2012, 15:28
A HAPPY BUNNY :a37:

ZariL
20-01-2012, 08:46
Car specific FFB support?
Real clutch car fixes?

Franco Ferrari
05-12-2012, 14:25
Just a quick question: are there any plans on which vehicles will be developed next, from the list (http://forum.wmdportal.com/showthread.php?2218-List-of-Vehicles-in-Project-CARS&p=42891&viewfull=1#post42891) of future vehicles... or this is something that is decided "at the moment"?

Related question: which one of the open-wheel Lotus(es) is going to be developed next?

Thanks. :)

StudeBakerAE86
05-12-2012, 21:07
Just a quick question: are there any plans on which vehicles will be developed next, from the list (http://forum.wmdportal.com/showthread.php?2218-List-of-Vehicles-in-Project-CARS&p=42891&viewfull=1#post42891) of future vehicles... or this is something that is decided "at the moment"?

Related question: which one of the open-wheel Lotus(es) is going to be developed next?

Thanks. :)

I remember that it would be the car for which the best data are available atm.

Zappatime
10-12-2012, 18:27
I don't see any reference to pit crew/track marshall animations and implementation - where do they fall, or are they for a later phase of the development?

ibby
10-12-2012, 18:52
I don't see any reference to pit crew/track marshall animations and implementation - where do they fall, or are they for a later phase of the development?

Thread was made in 2011. ;)
Would be cool to have it updated more.

xez
10-12-2012, 21:43
Andy, it would be great if the 'slippery kerb issue' was among the early priorities for fixing too. :D


A brief update - we're still not quite ready to enter full design, planning and production but we have come up with a short term priority list based on member feedback and available team resources. In very rough priority order (but all will be started soon if they haven't been already) this is:

Input lag (new threading system)
New FFB system
Car specific steering lock support
Fix low speed grip issue
Trees improved
Improved car reflections
Car and track updates as usual
Tire deformation
Open face driver added for 67 car
AI parameters exposed in UI
Night lighting
"High detail player car" option added to UI
Vehicle livery selection in UI
1st person driver animations
GUI usability improvements (including track select menu)
Kart physics fixes (low speed grip fix will help a lot)
Leaderboards (specifically client-server instant updates, ghost support)
Multiplayer
Pit-to-car radio
Damage fixes/improvements, including wheel to wheel contacts
Dynamic time/weather system
Driving school
Slow motion replays
Camera tool for use by team members
Web leaderboards
Helmet cam with reflections

Remco Van Dijk
11-12-2012, 07:46
Andy, it would be great if the 'slippery kerb issue' was among the early priorities for fixing too. :D
Of course that list was made before STM was introduced and started doing funny things with kerbs :)

xez
11-12-2012, 07:49
Ooops. Hadn't noticed the dates on the earlier posts! Oh well. Here's hoping that the kerbs will get fixed soon anyway!

Benjamin Fischer
11-12-2012, 07:49
Thread was made in 2011. ;)
Would be cool to have it updated more.

In general I would love to see a high level milestone plan for the next couple of months

morning_wood
13-12-2012, 07:25
the one thing I have been waiting for...
buttons for in-car brake bias adjustment ( for those cars that have it )

the one thing that nearly every sim has is sorely missing thus far in pCars